Pat McCrory's shaky voter suppression soapbox

The Charlotte Observer thinks Pat McCrory is full of crap. So should you.

What Republicans are trying to accomplish is clear: The voters who are most likely to be affected by the voter ID law are low-income minorities, who tend to vote Democrat. It's the same motive that's behind Republican-led legislation across the country that restricts voting, including in North Carolina, where lawmakers are considering overturning Gov. Bev Perdue's veto of a voter ID bill. Some states are doing a particularly poor job of hiding their intentions, such as Texas, which rejected student IDs issued by state universities in its new voter ID law, but did give the nod to anyone with a handgun license.

Comments

I Respectively Disagree.

James,
I support Pat McCrory's efforts on voter IDs. It's not intended at all to suppress minority voting. It is intended to prevent fraudulent voting by applying the same requirement we all have to cash a check in any bank. Everybody cashes checks, right?

It's not a difficult requirement to show a voter ID to prove you are who you say you are. With all the illegal aliens living in NC, we need to guard against them voting, they are not entitled to vote. It is a privilege of citizenry to vote. Imagine how discouraged voters would become if they thought their votes were interfered by fraudulent voting. This occured in NC during the last election.

Absentee ballots

To whom does the voter show his identification when voting by absentee ballot?

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The measure of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little. - FDR

I presume the local Board of Elections

One would have to make a formal request to get an absentee ballot. Right now all you have to do is send a written request to the Board of Elections. If this requirement became law, provisions would be required to show a photo ID to the Board of Elections before they issued you the ballot.

What?

If this requirement became law, provisions would be required to show a photo ID to the Board of Elections before they issued you the ballot.

So you are a sailor stationed onboard a guided missile cruiser deployed to Westpac. Or you are a Peace Corps worker on a two-year assignment in Botswana. How exactly do you meet the requirement to show a photo ID to the Board of Elections before they issue you a ballot?

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The measure of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little. - FDR

Have you ever heard of something called a Notary Public?

I'm sure this could be legally worked out by having a notary witness your signature and check your photo ID to verify your identity. I'm sure there are such things on a ship. A Peace Corps worker could do the same thing via the local embassy. Where there is a will, there is a way!

The local embassy?

The local embassy might be hundreds of miles away. Who will pay for the Peace Corps worker to travel to the "local embassy"???

And there are no notaries onboard ships.

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The measure of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little. - FDR

Voter ID

Frank, it seems your analogy is a little far off. Every American has a fundamental right to vote in elections. We do not have a fundamental right to have a bank account.Most banks will not even cash a check now unless you have an established account with them. Everyone also has to provide some form of identification when they register to vote and show proof of address, etc. IN NC we also have several layers already in place by Boards of Election to prevent voter fraud and it works quite well. Sure did work well in November when those few were caught voting twice. Remember that? The Republicans seem to want to preach the need for Voter ID for a problem that doesnt exist, however, during the Iowa caucuses next week, will the Republicans require voter ID for those who vote then? Betcha they dont! And what voter fraud was that Frank in the last election? They were caught without voter ID were they not?

Voter ID not a problem, it's a solution.

W, I didn't intend to equate bank accounts with the right to vote. All I was showing is that in our day to day routine we are required to show photo IDs like when we cash a check.

I'm reminded of a saying, "Where there is smoke, there is fire." How many other fraudulent voters are out there that weren't caught? How can we be sure that illegal aliens are not voting?

I've always been bothered that when I vote, nobody wants to see my voter registration card. It just seems to easy to commit fraud. More precautions are in order.

The issue we are discussing here is showing a voter ID in NC to vote, not in Iowa. That's for them to decide.

Why do you think W?

Why should we tell the people of Iowa how they handle their voting process? We are discussing the law in North Carolina, not the nation.

But yes in my opinion everyone should show a photo ID.

Non issue

Voter ID is a solution looking for a problem ... at a cost that a conservative like you should find abhorrent. Based on experience in other states, the proposed legislation will cost approximately $7 million per year to implement ... which translates into about a million bucks for each illegal vote prevented.

More to the point, there is no evidence that illegal voting is going on. None. Not even by the scary brown people who will be the majority in this state within a couple of generations.

I'll say this, Mr. Burns. You are at least consistent in your reactionary politics, with an opinion to refute every fact that's fired across your bow. Keep digging in your heels with uninformed positions like your embrace of Voter Suppression and it won't be long before you have us all trained to ignore you.

Discussions with you remind me of discussion with my evangelical siblings, which have evaporated into nonexistence. When they prefaces their comments with "I believe" or "I have faith," the best I can do is roll my eyes and move on to talking about the weather. You may "believe" illegal voting is a problem, but that doesn't make it so.

James

PS Do you even know any illegal immigrants? I know plenty, and I will say without fear of contradiction that NONE of them would ever consider showing up to vote in any election. They may be here illegally, but they're not stupid.

Reply to James

James, I'm certain we could find a way to issue IDs to people who don't have drivers license at no additional cost. We could ask the citizens who do not have driver's licenses to report to the Department of Motor Vehicles and receive your photo ID with a statement, "Not authorized for Driving in NC". How does something like that cost millions of dollars? The system is in place and won't cost a dime.

James are you not interested in all from hearing differing point of views? There are facts that support my point of view as well.

Yes the previous poster, W Jones mentioned that the people in NC who were involved with voter fraud were caught. But how do we know that others out there voted fraudulently and were not caught? This is a simple fix by asking voters to show a photo ID.

Yes I know illegal immigrants and I am friends with them and respect them as people but they are still not citizens and should not vote.

The Driver's license office

Looked up online...driver's license offices in Clay and Alleghany counties are open one day a week. Driver's license offices in Bertie and Currituck counties are open one day a month....I didn't check all 100 counties, but I'm sure you get the point.

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The measure of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little. - FDR

Reply to Frank

Yes the previous poster, W Jones mentioned that the people in NC who were involved with voter fraud were caught. But how do we know that others out there voted fraudulently and were not caught? This is a simple fix by asking voters to show a photo ID.

Yes I know illegal immigrants and I am friends with them and respect them as people but they are still not citizens and should not vote. Frank Burns

Psst! Frank All Boards of Elections in NC have the same verification process.All ballots are checked and double checked for duplication before they are even certified. The system works well! The solution is not spending money to generate a photo ID. Also, all DMV offices in NC do not issue a license at the DMV any longer. They are now all issued by Central Processing in Raleigh and mailed. Generating the photo, processing, and mailing costs money! They dont give that stuff away Frank!

As James mentioned, they arent stupid. The Problem is when YOU walk in an emergency room and see those brown people you automatically think they are illegal. Thats the problem! Actually, in all my years of voting, I have never seen an illegal alien voting. Dont worry Frank! The Tea Party has scared you into that line of thinking.

Psst W......

You easily get a printout on the voting record of the people within your district to see how they voted. If resident A has moved and illegal alien B knows that, he can just say that he is resident A. Tell me how the verification process would catch that?

I'm confident a low cost solution can be developed between DMV and central processing. As I understand it, the group people who don't have drivers license if not a large number. It's difficult for me to see that this would cost millions of dollars.

W, how do you know that you have never seen an illegal alien vote? Do you not associate with those brown people? I do.

The Tea Party has no interest in this issue. The Tea Party wants the government to become smaller and live within it's means, like we have to do.

Not prosecuted

Yes, I'm sure if it is not prosecuted or caught,it didn't really happen. Rape victims would surely agree.

Bad analogy

Aside from the fact that you're using an issue that has adversely impacted the lives of some 1 in 5 women/girls in our country to give credence to an act that will adversely impact the voting rights of some of those very same women, you're also ignoring some glaring differences in the "whys" of underreporting and non-prosecution.

Fear of retribution, fear of social stigma, inability to prove "beyond a reasonable doubt" to a jury that's been steeped in the moral ambiguity of our borderline misogynistic society. You'll find none of those powerful forces at play in the voter fraud formula.

But even if we grant you that James' numbers above are missing some prosecutions, and we increase them tenfold, that's still only a fraction of 1% of votes cast fraudulently.

It's not just a red herring. If we eat that fish we'll get sick.

No the bad analogy IMO is

No the bad analogy IMO is accepting the stats as there is no problem. Be against it for discrimination purpose,but please don't come off as if it isn't reported it didn't happen which I think is insulting for victims of unreported crime.