Why Preachers Are Not Lawyers: Or Why This Guy Wants in Your Bedroom

Last week a North Carolina Superior Court judge struck down a law prohibiting unmarried couples to cohabitate (BlueNC post here). The case came up when a 911 operator was fired for violating the 200 year old law. Now the inevitable well thought out "proper" Christian response has come. Of course, they do not like people's private lives being free from government intrusion. This article by Rev. Mark Creech of the Christian Action League of North Carolina seems pretty representative and expected. Their reason for supporting the law is quite simply that it is God's law, derived directly from the seventh commandment (Thou shalt not commit adultery). I know that that logical jump from adultery to premarital cohabitation might seem a bit much, but that is why he is a preacher I guess.

Anyway, that response was expected, but what really riles me is the putrid attempt to attack the legal credibility of the ruling:

Judge Alford's decision was judicial activism at its best. The state's lawyers rightly argued Hobbs didn't have standing in the case because she never had even been charged with a crime. Moreover, legal experts still debate the meaning of the Lawrence v. Texas case and how it applies to state law.

For a little legal lesson for Rev. Creech, standing requires 1) that there is a legal injury and 2) that the governmental action caused the injury. In this case, the plaintiff was fired (an injury) caused by the fact that she was claimed to be in violation of the law (causation). Standing to challenge governmental action does not always require that someone be charged with a crime. So I do not see any question that there is standing.

As far as the ridiculous statement that it is unclear how Lawrence v. Texas applies to state laws, Lawrence was directed at striking down a Texas state statute. So whatever contours of Lawrence need to be flushed out in the courts, it is clear that it does apply to state law.

The bottom line is that regardless of what you think about striking down the law, it is pretty clear that the legal arguments are on the side of privacy on this one.

I know that I should not be surprised about misleading statements being made in the name of God, but I do feel more obliged to point them out nonetheless. Anyway, if you have the misfortune of running into anyone throwing these arguments around at a dinner party or elsewhere, now you will know that these arguments are full of it.

Comments

Oh, Creech.

Wasn't he that kid from Saved By the Bell? This isn't the good Reverend's first appearance on BlueNC's pages, and it doesn't look like he's grown any wiser since then.

It's funny that his problem with the application of Lawrence is that it's contours aren't fully fleshed out. And how will the full effect of Lawrence become clear? Through cases like this one. Which the Reverend has a problem with because the contours of Lawrence aren't fully... are we seeing the circle here? It's a bit like arguing that children shouldn't be allowed to grow into adults until we're sure what kind of adults they'll become.

But then, why let unclear thinking stand in the way of a good bluster, eh Reverend?

Way to ruin my morning

Here I am, perfectly prepared to take on the day and maybe even have a good breakfast and ... pow ... I get to see this creepmeister grinning like the jackass he is. Yuck.

Hehehe

He is quite the smarmy looking fellow. The sad news is that they can twist biblical passages to say just about anything they want them to.

From where I'm sitting that suit looks like a wool blend and according to Leviticus (can't remember chapter and verse) that man's a sinner. If all of God's laws were adopted by man, his suit would be against the law.



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Vote Democratic! The ass you save may be your own.

Intelligent Home Design?

Creech is also the guy who said it wasn't government's job to feed the poor. Some Christian and, he is listed as an advisor of Called2Action. At least he was before recently they scrubbed their website of names of supporters. This is what was in the trash can:

Board of Directors

Steve Noble, Chairman, Owner, Paint Co., Inc.
Steve Henion, Vice Chairman, Real Estate Broker, RE/MAX United
Sharon Andrews, Sales Manager, Coldwell Banker Advantage New Homes
Jim Anthony, President, Anthony & Company
Jerry Boyd, Small Business Owner
Dr. Steven Breedlove, Associate Pastor, Church of the Apostles
Elder William Cooper, First Assistant, Upper Room Church of God in Christ
Sarah Harden, President, Wake Citizens for Excellence in Education
Judy Keener, Christian Political Activist
Edith Struik, Volunteer Family Resources Coordinator, Focus on the Family Ministries

Advisory Council

Russell Capps, State Representative, North Carolina District 50
Robert Casey, Christian Lawyers Group
John Converse, former Wake County Commissioner
Rev. Mark Creech, Founder & President, Christian Action League of North Carolina
Anne Foster, Media Consultant
Gerald Gayton, Mortgage Consultant, North Carolina Loans, Inc.
Drew Goettman, Founder, OnlineChristian.Info
Neal Hunt, Raleigh City Council
Scott Lycan, Director, Pregnancy Life Care Center
Johnny & Lynda McConnell, Real Estate Developer; Housewife
Bill Mann, Attorney
Ron Margiotta, Wake County School Board Member
Don Roberts, Regional Accounts Manager, Money Mailer of NC
Jay Stott, Priority Associates
Pastor Olden Thornton, Raleigh International Church

Ya think some of those listed

realized it wasn't necessarily a good thing to be associated with that group? Why would they remove the names from public view? Hmmmmmm?



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Vote Democratic! The ass you save may be your own.

They knew Greg

would call them out. Sort of reminds me of flashlights and cockroaches.

Good catch, Mr. Flynn.

Creech

Take a good look. Do you think he may eat some pork? Maybe some ham biscuits? Maybe some shell fish? Whatever it is, it's a lot of it.

Lovex7

One more

Not on the list is one of their big supporters, Tom Vande Guchte, President of Storr Office Environments. He contibuted $1,000 to their PAC Called2Elect and has his company involved with Corporate Chaplains of America. He seems like a decent guy but his liberal clients would be surprised about his direct support for this agenda.

“ At first our leadership team didn’t think the idea of having a chaplain coming around here was such a good idea; now they are all the biggest cheerleaders of the program. I can recommend the program without reservation.”

The freepers

Are squabbling with one another over this issue, which is always fun to watch.

Nice of the good reverend to give us license to interpret the commandments as we see fit:

The Seventh Commandment, "Thou shalt not commit adultery," which could also be correctly translated, "Thou shalt not commit sexual immorality,"..

I have another one. "Remember the sabbath, to keep it holy," should now be interpreted to mean: thou shalt not have NASCAR races, NFL football games, beer, or tailgate parties on the sabbath, to keep it holy. 

It's not about morals or values, you know.  It's all about control. All hail the coming theocracy! (But not yet!)

Nice post, TarGator.  Good balance of invective and research. *tips hat*

And another thing

How do you interpret "Thou shalt not commit adultery" to really mean "Thou shalt not commit sexual immorality", when out the other side of your big mouth comes, "Thou shalt not kill" doesn't really mean "Thou shalt not kill". It really means "Thou shalt not commit murder" which doesn't mean you can't kill. When I heard a "christian youth" recite that nonsense on the radio a few years back, I about drove off the road.

And THUS the self-righteous follower of the Prince of Peace frees himself to support war for any reason and the death penalty. Perfect. These sorts of folks really ought not wish so hard for the Rapture. If God does come in the clouds to get His own, I don't know who will go, but I'm pretty sure it won't be those jokers.

"They took all the trees and put them in a tree museum Then they charged the people a dollar 'n a half just to see 'em. Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got till it's gone? They paved paradise and put up a parking lot."