Second Debate: This time from the Granite State

Simple Open Thread for the Debate in the Granite State.

I wasnt really able to watch the pre-debate coverage. Mostly because of stories like this on Lou Dobbs.

I hope Wolf Blitzer isnt too annoying.

Comments

First question

to Obama.

"no terrorist attacks" lie repeated by question. Obama accepts it, gives scant praise to Bush, says Bush has made us less safe.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Edwards

repeats that GWOT is a bumper sticker. Says he will use all available tools to protect America.

Hillary believes in the war on terror. 9/11 9/11 9/11 Says, "We are safer than we were"

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Biden

stands behind his vote.

"Some votes are worth losing an election over" At least he has a reason.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Obama

Political solution. Not Military solution.

Edwards focuses on leadership. Gave praise to Dodd. Said, "they went quietly to the senate floor. didnt say anything." Wolf made him name hillary and obama. Pissed Obama off, Hillary laughed. Good for her to put forward a good face.

Obama, "John you are about 4 1/2 years late" (His math is questionable) He then said something I didnt get. Hillary says, "This is George Bush's war." Keeps saying that everyone on the stage is trying to end the war.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Dodd

Weaker not stronger. (apparently only hillary thinks we are safer). Dodd gave a good policy answer.

Next question to Richardson, "what if leaving leads to genocide?" Hits his resume points and doesnt answer the question until pushed twice by Wolf. Then waffles and gets back to talking points.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Kucinich

wants defunding.

Biden says we dont have the votes. Says we wont end the war until there is a Democratic President.

Says the only one who has emboldened the enemy is George Bush.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Hillary

blames the iraqis. Says she was briefed and knew everything she needed to know without reading the NIE. says that if Bush had allowed inspectors to finish we would have not gone to war.

Edwards, agreed to everything Hillary says and then said, "One difference is that I believe I was wrong." Gives Obama credit for being right early.

Obama nice back to Edwards about ignoring "fear mongering" Says Iraq is a huge distraction from Afghanistan.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Richardson

says this bill is not amnesty. Wont support a bill that separates family.

Biden used the phrase "earned citizenship". Keeps coming out on the moderate, Senator side. I think he should stay there.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Obama

lots of hope and grand ideas.

Raising of hands:
"Should English be the official language?"
Gravel is the only one who says yes. Obama says, "that type of question is meant to divide us." Great response about not being distracted by wedge issues.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Health care

Question to Edwards: "Are Hillary and Richardson right when they say we can have health care without more taxes"

Hits mental health. Says for real universal health care we need more revenue. Says its dishonest to say we can have universal care with less taxes.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Hillary

"I have the scars" Says the plan isnt the most important thing. Keeps trying to say there is no difference between anyone. Long boring response.

I really really really dont like her.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Richardson

still doesnt look great on live tv.

Dodd talked about cooperation.

Edwards says Obama's plan leaves 15 million uncovered. Talks about how wrong Hillary is on the issue of taxes.

Hillary is glowing that they are arguing. Too bad she doesnt realize this is proving there are differences and that they both have actual plans.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Obama Universal Health Care.

The plan doesn't mandate universal health care, that is not universal health care. Teh Free Market will not work.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Kucinich

hits all the reasons why we need UHC. Says we need single payer. Plugs his bill.

Says the top three are letting insurance companies keep their power. got some applause.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Great line

Hillary quoted Barry Goldwater:
"You dont have to be straight to shoot straight."
Talks of compromise.

Biden, "Peter Pace is flat wrong." Then talks about how it doesnt matter in a fox hole.

Every single one raised their hand to say they were against dont ask dont tell.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

How would you use Bill Clinton?

Gravel says as an ambassador.

Richardson tries some humor, fails. Says he would make Bill "Middle East Peace Envoy"

Obama made a good statement, but had nothing to do with the issue.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

edit- Hillary wants to use all past presidents, especially bill, as a roving ambassador to restore our place in the world.

"Keep the Faith"

Use W

as a scarecrow in some east Kenyan corn field

W goes to Darfur



Robin Hayes lied. Nobody died, but thousands of folks lost their jobs.



***************************
Vote Democratic! The ass you save may be your own.

Energy

Gravel: "There is nothing I would do to lower the price of gas"
Says he agrees with Dodd that we need a carbon tax, but that that will raise the price.

Edwards wants to investigate oil and gas companies. "Vertical integration" DOJ investigation. Stop subsidising.

Long answer by Richardson. Cut off by Wolf. Good moderation by him.

Biden. Price Gouging. Raise mileage on automobiles.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Richardson

He just talks too much.

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

3 min break

dog goes outside to pee.

Spin spin spin

Cheesy hand shaking. Larry is happy

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

CNN is talkign about John Edwards a LOT

They are all very pro-JRE right now.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

It's great they get to be there.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Problem with 9 candidates.

the war question goes to Kucinich. Kucinich will NOT be our next President, or our next Democratic nominee. It's great that is out there throwing out his opinion, but it results in other, better candidates not having time to answer.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Here we go

sitting in chairs. Real questions from indy voters. (in theory)

First question, wife of soldier in iraq. elementary school teacher. last week 2 of her husband's "team mates" died
What would you do to rebuild the military? Kucinich answers first, talks about leaving. talks about peace, military as a peacekeeping force. Says we need to cut military spending and focus all of our money on the troops.

Obama is riled up by Wolf. (not really, but the blitz tried) Good answer by Obama about ending long tours of troops. Taking care of them when they come home.

Big ups for the troops by Dodd. Gets other candidates to applaud on his point. "Principal responsibility is to keep us secure. Military is not the first option". 21st century military needs.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Next

son in Iraq. "Why cant vets use the hospital of their choice?"
Obama is first. VA Hospital system can be good by avoiding drug price jumps and other extortions. VA hospital system is essential. Private hospital should be allowed when there isnt a VA hospital available (rural areas).

Richardson disagrees. Says husband instead of son (woops). Says they have to have the choice, ignoring Obama's actual response. Some empty rhetoric.

Gravel is being less rude this time. Obama is getting a lot of face time during this part.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Iran.

This is a no-brainer at this point. You have to say you want diplomacy.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Iran is next

question from a lady who spent time living in Iran.

Clinton says we need to talk. "We used to always talk to the Soviet Union." Referenced Richardson's work on behalf of Bill. Keeps the hawkishness even with endorsing diplomacy. Wolf- What if it doesnt work? "Im not gonna engage in hypotheticals." Hits cheney in a joke.

How far would you go? Edwards, references rallies in support of US after 9/11. Talks details about domestic Iranian policies. Wants carrots from Europe and economic incentives. On table for Iranian people to hear. Not behind closed doors. "We need to drive a wedge between the people and this leader" Wont take options off the table.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Bin Laden

Kucinich wouldnt kill Bin Laden if we knew where he was and could kill him with a missile.

Obama would take him out. "He has declared war on us." We are weaker because of the war in Iraq.

Raising Hands time. If innocents died would you kill Obama.

Most raised their hand. Hillary and Biden say, "how many innocents." Hillary uses Bill's experience to show some experience.

Edwards- foreign policy points. Emphasizing democracies, but have to recognize that radical islam might take over.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Biden

Making his play.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Darfur

Biden - Stop Talking about it. "Sudan has forfeited their sovereignty by committing genocide." Wants a no fly zone.

Raise hands. "Do you agree with Biden that we need military force?" lots of talking. "no fly zone" instead Hillary keeps nipping hypotheticals in the bud. Good for her. Richardson would not use force. (long response)

Most wanted to raise hands but the question got nipped in the bud because Wolf didnt ask it right.

Should we boycott Bejing olympics because of China giving money to Sudan? Dodd says we need to use influence but not boycott olympics. use our tools, but boycotting would hurt us.

Edwards thinks we should use all of our options. Applauds Biden and Richardson. We have no moral authority to lead on the issue. Hit on his world wide points.

Obama talking about "security and humanitarian interest" in protecting people in ungoverned areas. Bush has eroded our moral ability.

Dodd has a great response. Only Richardson and Edwards would boycott Olympics. Biden is pissed about all the talking. Obama says, "all of us agree with that" Obama just made Biden look silly even though Biden got some applause.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

National Service

question from an 18 year old. If Edwards isnt given time to answer I am going to cry.

Gravel- every year you serve we will give 4 years of education.
Kucinich- references Kennedy.

Wolf: Is it time for the draft? Dodd says no. Likes general idea of national service and using it to further financial abilities of people to go to college.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Gravel on service.

I thought that was a great idea, serve one year in the Army, Peace Corps, Americorps, and we'll give you four years of college. It's an interesting take, because i support Edwards plan of having college for everyone if they are willing to work 10 hours a week the first year. You need to have some hook to convince people they can afford it.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

There is the College for Everyone plan.

As someone who worked as a baker, waiter, dish washer, roof truss builder, logging truck grunt, painter, animal handler and who knows what else I can't recall, I support having to work your way through college.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

What do you mean by rich?

Obama- over $250,000 per year. Back to tax rates under Clinton. Long response, didnt get much out of it. "Fairness" Tried to connect with questioner, but didnt really I dont think. Wolf asked for a specific number even though Obama already gave it, giving Obama even more time to talk. "Are we spending the money we have wisely?"

"What is a rich person?" Edwards- roll it back for people over $200,000. College education. References his college for everyone idea and actual program he and Elizabeth have in ENC.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

SHUT UP Richardson.

He loves to hear himself talk.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

I repeat, stop it.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Jeez

Richardson wants line item veto and amendment requiring a balanced budget. The 2000s happened and they just passed him by. He sounds like Clinton in 95 (at best). Says we need to end corporate welfare then talks about incentives to companies.

Wolf says Republicans will say its a bunch of tax and spend liberals then gives the floor to Kucinich. Screw you Wolf.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

You just proved me wrong.,

I missed some of the debate getting the kids to bed.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Kucinich and Gravel.

I wonder what CNN's take was, now I see. They have given the largest microphones to Kucinich and Gravel, the farthest-left candidates we have. THAT is what people who pass by will be left with as their impression.

One man with courage makes a majority.
- Andrew Jackson

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Sam would be proud.

Biden's winning me over.

Fear not the path of truth for the lack of people walking on it. - Robert F. Kennedy

----
There are people in every time and every land who want to stop history in its tracks. They fear the future, mistrust the present, and invoke the security of the comfortable past which, in fact, never existed. - Robert F. Kennedy

I like Biden

as a Senator. Not sure about as a President. He's got a lot of knowledge and experience. I could even see him in a cabinet level position.

____________

I tuned out

all the last question. woops.

What is your top priority for the first 100 days?

Edwards- Reestablish America's moral authority in the world. "Poor, who we havent talked about unfortuantely" "Moral and Just"

Could Wolf interrupt him any more?

Hillary- Bring the troops home.

Obama- Bring troops home and health care.

Richardson- pandering. Between this and last we are at 3 answers on his first few days in office.

Biden- war in iraq, deal with iran and south korea

Kucinich- "reshape world for peace" cancel WTO and NAFTA. single payer health care

Gravel- no answer cause he is crazy

Dodd- Restore constitutional rights. applause.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

Final numbers

Obama then Hillary then Wolf

edit- other graph updated and is slowing down site.

Draft Brad Miller-- NC Sen ActBlue

"Keep the Faith"

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