The morning after

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Pretty much sez it all.

election

speechless

TurnNCBlue

The country moves forward!!

North Carolina goes into reverse. This might just have become the decade of the NC Neanderthal or the Time of the Tarheel Taliban. ohhhhh ... shit.

I actively oppose gerrymandering. Do you?

Ervin was leading in every

Ervin was leading in every poll. How did this happen? Is NC just another Southern state? Does Hagan stand a chance in 2014?

2 reasons

1) He was outspent with a lot of outside money

2) Even though he did okay in the polls, they always had insane amounts of undecideds who could be influenced by money and last minute ads

That's my guess anyways

Advice for McCrory?

Fat chance.

McCrory won’t succeed in the long run by ignoring the interests and concerns of nearly half the electorate. Nor should he let Republican legislators, although they have a two-year head start in power, dictate an overly conservative agenda.

Don't hold your breath expecting the governor-elect to reach across any aisles in any attempt to rein in the radical right. We invited him to visit us at BlueNC a dozen times during this campaign and never got even the benefit of a "no thank you."

From what I can tell, McCrory is a vindictive hot-head who will consider his slim margin of victory as a wide-ranging mandate to unleash monied interests. And before you know it, NC will be scraping the bottom of the barrel ... vying for worst in everything ... like South Carolina.

Prove me wrong, Mr. McCrory. I double-dog dare you.

You Can Thank David Parker & his supporters

NCDP needs throw out David Parker and clean the SEC House. The SEC Members do not seem to understand the implications of having the GOP in charge, redistricting, and how hard it will be to win seats back. It takes money & organization. Two things the current SEC seems to hold in distain.

David's empty promises is what kept him in office....with no organizing, no raising money, and no RESPECT. Those who worked so hard to keep him there need to be booted off the SEC.

The NCGOP has a SEC smart enough to know what is important is WINNING elections - not platform speeches. They had the common sense to elected an ELECTED OFFICIAL who knew how to raise money, run a campaign and win.

Rather than throwing stones at McCrory & Co. Democrats across NC should tell the David Parker "oh no we don't accept your resignation" SEC crowd to get wake up and smell the reality.....

I hope come 2013 there is a strong Democrat with a PROVEN record of victory to turn the NCDP around willing to run for Chair - and - that the SEC gains the wisdom to elect that individual.

There is too much a stake to worry about individual favors, promises, SEC committee assignments and tax check off money.

We need a professional to clean up the mess David & his minions have left behind.

Right you are.

Well said, IMO.

Had almost exactly this conversation

the other day with one of my offspring, including the part about the Parker supporters who pulled that stunt that allowed him to remain.

Part of the reason I'm still pissed off about that is going to sound a little ego-centric, but I can't shake the feeling, so I'll just throw it out there and take whatever criticism comes my way: I feel used.

When I spoke out against Don Vaughan for being a long-time ALEC member, it wasn't because I didn't want a new Chairman, it was because I didn't want him as Chairman. Nothing personal, but ALEC had been exposed as an enemy of Democracy for 2-3 years before Don put his name forward. If he didn't know, that means he is so far out of the political loop he'd be useless as Chairman. If he did know, that means he didn't care too much for Democratic principles. Either way, he was wrong for the job.

The problem is (and this is where I feel used), the Parker supporters saw the Vaughan crisis as a way to undermine the movement to heal the Party, and they took it. Forget about how it might fracture the Party, and forget about how it might chill potential donors. All they saw was Victory, and they didn't stop to consider the pyrrhic nature of such.

That's not vision, it's selfishness, and a good leader would not have allowed that.

Fetzer

For the record, Fetzer was a political "consultant" and former "elected" who raked in millions before taking that position.

WAFranklin and WakeVerifiedVoting Have Jumped the Shark

Both of those posters have time and again said that our elected Democratic officials (example, council of state) have no role in the direction and leadership of the party, but when some of those elected officials don't attend SEC meetings and precinct meetings, et cetera, wafranklin and wakeverifiedvoting (telesca) get all hot-and-bothered - incensed even - that those elected officials haven't and won't pay attention to the Democratic party.

So, either you want them not to pay attention and not to participate in the leadership of the Democratic party --- or you want these elected officials to pay attention and participate.

Gentlemen, you can't and shouldn't have it both ways.

When Democratic elected officials, the council of state (now our State's highest elected Democrats), and other electeds like our legislators weigh in on matters that affect our people, public policy, implementation of the Party platform, and the election of our future officials, we in the Party should listen. It does not mean blind obedience, but listening respectfully and weighing it without espousing vitriol.

And one more thing gentlemen -- many SEC members and many Dem activists participate in the direction of the party only part-time, sometimes only at precinct meetings or county conventions or just before election time, or on blogs. Our elected Democrats on the Council of State and in our legislature and in Congress participate EVERY DAY, full-time, fighting for the rest of us.

Though I respect their right to voice their opinions, the opinions of wafranklin and wakeverifiedvoting about the role of our elected officials in party direction have become offensive to those of us who respect our Party's warriors who fight for us every day and night, putting their names, their careers, their privacy and their legacies on the line every step of the way. If one of our elected Democrats has a concern or a recommendation, then we shouldn't ignore it. They are elected because they are leaders, and we shouldn't discount their leadership when issues or crises present themselves.

Because wafranklin and wakeverifiedvoting post mostly the same stuff all the time, many readers who've chosen to ignore those posts because Bill and Chris have jumped the shark.

The GOP took control of the GA in 2010

Parker was NOT chair at the time. Young, the anointed golden boy, did zero for the NCDP in his 2 year term. Parker may be criticized for some of his actions, but NOT for allowing the gerrymandering which further increased the GOP hold on the GA. You make it sound so simple - just some organization and some money. Wow, really? OFA sucked most of that energy up starting in 2008.

Also, as far as I am concerned, it's the dems who got their panties in a wad after Parker was retained as chair that should take a share of the blame for the current divisions in the party. If they had accepted the democratic decision of the SEC and moved on things might have gone better, but then again perhaps not. The state is near about perfectly rigged for GOP dominance, and any real change will have to wait until either the courts throw the current voting districts out or the year 2020.

Again, Parker was defeated for chair in 2009. Who knows, he might have put up more of a fight in 2010 than Young did ... actually that wouldn't have been too difficult.

I'll agree that the NCDP is a mess, but I am sure that new leadership is on the way in 2013. Who that leader will be and what will that leader do in the face of total gerrymandering are the big questions.

I actively oppose gerrymandering. Do you?

Who knows?

Good question.

To me the more important consideration is that neither of these individuals has the foresight, leadership and drive to get the job done. I don't fault them ... they are who they are. It's more a commentary on the leadership vacuum that exists.

The best people on the left ... folks like Joe Hackney ... are saying "no thanks" to ongoing leadership. Again, I don't fault them. I'm just trying to paint an accurate picture of the situation, which by any measure is a total fucking mess.

The foresight, leadership and drive?

Really - you think that's all it takes?

David Parker had so many things working against him in 2011: the 2010 legislative losses, Citizens United, OFA and the DNC Convention in Charlotte.

Hell - OFA punked the Democratic Party after the 2008 election. They promised us their volunteer list, and failed to deliver. They wanted to be invited to every Democratic Party function to recruit for OFA, and never put in a good word for the Democratic Party. They poached our volunteers in 2008, and were doing the same thing in 2012.

The DNC Convention sucked all the oxygen out of the room. People lost their minds trying to get to Charlotte - and do what? They had no one else to nominate other than Barack Obama. They had no other platform to adopt other than the one pushed by the President. That farce of an amendment that was pushed on the convention floor showed just how worthless that convention was - other than as a way to bring money to Charlotte businesses and puff up the resumes of the staffers who worked there.

DNC convention in Denver - Obama wins NC by 14K votes. DNC convention in Charlotte - Obama loses NC by 97K votes. And built up the GOP majority in the NCGA and lost the Gov race (and majority control of the SBOE). Tell me again how great it was for us to have the convention here?

Chris Telesca
Wake County Verified Voting
http://noirvnc.blogspot.com
http://statewideirvnc.blogspot.com

Wow - thanks for posting anonymously!

The Chair of the Party is not supposed to run campaigns. They are supposed to preside over the body, understand the rules, and run the meetings. They are supposed to hire staff to help build the Party and motivate volunteers to get active, collaborate on the Party Platform, canvass and phone bank to build interest, work on getting out the vote for ALL the Party candidates, and then use the collective leverage of the volunteer members to get our electeds to turn our Party platform into public policy.

Wow - almost no blame for the fact that David Young and some folks were running the NCDP in 2010 when we lost control of BOTH the House and Senate. They didn't even see it coming! David Young had no experience within the Democratic Party organizing a precinct, being on the SEC, etc., when he was elected as NCDP Chair. He was elected as a figurehead - nothing more. But after he lost, we wanted no more figureheads. We elected David Parker because he understands how the Party works, having served at many different levels of the Party over the years.

David Parker got elected at a time when the NCDP lost control of the General Assembly. He had no control over that, nor any control over Citizens United. He could have worked hard to build the Party from the grassroots up, but three days after he got elected, we got saddled with the DNC Convention. And people lost their freaking minds wasting time getting picked to go to a dog-and-pony show in Charlotte that would accomplish exactly what?

I am on the SEC, and I didn't want electeds and candidates and campaign staffers and political consultants telling me how my party should be run. I didn't want them telling me who our Party leaders would be. That must really piss you off that David Parker's resignation was rejected by a greater margin of SEC members than got him elected to the office in the first place!

And who exactly was running to fill David's shoes? Have any of those candidates - Frank Eaton, Mary Anne Balwdin or Don Vaughn - even run a meeting as big as the NCDP SEC or the State Party convention? What's more - have any of them every organized a precinct? Do they know how the Party works? What about them makes them the sort of "professional" that you claim should be able to run the Party and clean up the "mess"?

Anyone thinking of running for the NCDP Chair office better realize that the Party is not just about winning elections and raising money. We were sold a bill of goods with David Young in 2009 - we were told that since he had won office as a county commissioner, he understood how to win elections. We were told he was a great fundraiser. Well how well did that work for us in 2010?

The people who worked for the Party or worked for the campaigns in 2010 who lost big for us then - what role did they play this year? if they were losers in 2010, who in their right mind would think they knew enough to do any better this year?

I think we need to seriously go back to what we did in 2005 - elect (or re-elect) a real grassroots person committed to building the Party from the precinct on up. We did that starting in 2005, and look how well it worked in 2006 and 2008!

Another factor in the huge ass kicking we got yesterday (and a factor in nearly every election loss since November 2008) is OFA. OFA was a campaign in 2008, and was morphed into some sort of action group from 2009 through 2011, then back into a billion-dollar business that was selling one thing: Barack Obama for President. They succeeded in getting him elected twice now, but the control they exercised the Democratic Party caused many problems: our losses since then. If the Obama ground game was more effective in 2012 than in 2008, why did Obama lose in NC by almost 97K votes across the state - or 35 votes per precinct? He won by 14,177 votes in 2008 - 5.14 votes per precinct. How the hell can you spend more money and have more people on the ground in NC than Romney did and then lose by such big numbers and not be part of the problem? What's different about 2012 is that there was no party-building the previous 4 years - starting in June 2008 when OFA started trashing Howard Dean's 50-state strategy and Jerry Meek's 100 county strategy.

Perdue had more votes than Obama did in 2008, and also a bigger margin - 145K votes. McCrory started running for Gov the day after he lost. We assumed that Bev would also be up for a re-match. But she waited till the last minute to say she wasn't running - which caused a mad scramble for the wanna-be Guvs. After bailing on us, she also kept nearly $2 million in campaign cash that could have helped Dalton. Bev's hoarding of that money certainly didn't help any Democratic candidates.

Both Howard Dean and Jerry Meek built up the Democratic Party that won elections not by thinking the way you would like them to. They won elections by building the Party from the grassroots up. Now that there is no DNC Convention to distract us, I'm ready to do what needed to be done starting in January 2011: kick out OFA and tear up or burn their playbook. Go back to building the Party from the grassroots up. We have the numbers and the demographics - we just need a good coach and good plays. And we need to recruit staff that can actually perform and not worry about how good they look sitting behind their desks, or if they comply with some style manual.

Chris Telesca
Wake County Verified Voting
http://noirvnc.blogspot.com
http://statewideirvnc.blogspot.com

Fail

There's plenty of fault to find on all fronts, including with people like me who have checked out of the party, and people like you who think you know everything about everything. But the proof of the pudding is in the tasting. The facts speak for themselves.

Jim Black, Easley, Perdue, Young, Parker, and Dalton ... along with the countless hard working folks in the trenches ... all well-meaning and good intentioned ... have fundamentally failed across the board. There's no other way to read it.

Maybe you want to find fault with nobody, but I would go the other way and find fault with everybody. You and me included. The job didn't get the job done. Period.

Your last comment falls short, too.

We have the numbers and the demographics - we just need a good coach and good plays.

Dems brought candidates with pea shooters to a nuclear war. They completely disregarded progressives, thinking they could count on left-leaning dollars while collaborating in a right-wing agenda.

It's going to get worse before it gets better.

Candidates and Officers are two different things

OFA disregarded progressives, who make up a significant part of the officers and delegates in the NCDP.

There really is only one Democratic Party - and it's made up of the officers and delegates who are chosen by voters who are registered as Democrats. There is nothing in the NCDP Plan of Organization which requires the Party to let any candidate, elected, staffer or paid operative to run the show.

When you include Black, Easley and Perdue and Dalton with Young and Parker, you show me how confused you are. And how far off the mark your comments fall.

Candidates and electeds who run with a "D" behind their name for years have not been paying attention to the largely progressive platform of our Party. Hell - Obama wasn't doing much of that himself.

You think Dems brought candidates to this contest? How exactly do you think that the Democratic Party brings candidates anywhere? Sure - the Party can recruit candidates, but recruit them to what Party? You seem to conveniently forget "Citizens United" and the fact that rich pukes can now buy elections like they never could before.

The only thing that could possibly equal that is the mass of a real grassroots operation. David Young never took advantage of that - because he wasn't brought into the role of Chair to do that. He was a figurehead. That didnt' work in 2010.

Parker won because he had the experience and history with the NCDP. But he got the DNC convention and had to deal with OFA trying to be more important than they have any right to expect to be. Those two things along with the new GOP majority, redistricting and "Citizens United" proved to be too much!

So now there is no reason for OFA to exist. If they still exist, I suggest they not have any role in our Party. In fact no more candidates/electeds, campaign managers or political operatives should have any more say than they would if they were elected an officer in the NCDP. We need to re-adopt the mantra of Howard Dean: "We need to take back our Party before we take back our Country!". We stopped operating like that after June 2008 because some folks thought that we needed to do whatever Obama's campaign staff wanted us to do. Please show me where in the DNC bylaws that any President gets to tell the DNC or any state or county Party how they operate? The President doesn't even have a vote on the DNC!

Chris Telesca
Wake County Verified Voting
http://noirvnc.blogspot.com
http://statewideirvnc.blogspot.com

The State Party is at best a

The State Party is at best a joke. So are most of the current office holders. Get Meeks back or someone of his strengths and ability or hunker down for a long nuclear winter because that is exactly where we are and will be. As for Hagan...if she votes against immigration reform as she did against the Dream Act I for on(an Anglo) will actively campaign for her opposition no matter what party. Until Democrats do not know who they are...what they stand for...even Meeks or a Howard Dean cannot save the State party. Hope that we have rebounded by 2016 because it will likely take that long in the short term to sort out and breath new fresh progressive dedicated life into the Democratic State party only then if we do some serious house cleaning and busting some serious ass. And do yourselves a favor and stop blaming Art Pope. When real people vote, real people win.

If so, you helped to make it so

If the NCDP rebounds, it will be in spite of people like you who are afraid to put their names in public. Consultant eh? Figure out how to help the party and not how to profit from its carcass.

wafranklin

 

The problem

The problem with your solution for the SEC is that the people who voted to keep Parker will no doubt stay while many of the rest of the SEC members will not put our names in the hat again because of our disgust at the whole process.

Please stop behaving like an ass

None of us knows who these anonymous persons are ... but I do know that many people have very good reasons for needing confidentiality. My personal story is relevant: I had to resign my day job because of my political blogging.

not true

the moderators know who they are based on where they post from. They just decide to post anonymously so they can get away with saying stuff and not having to take responsibility for what they say.

Chris Telesca
Wake County Verified Voting
http://noirvnc.blogspot.com
http://statewideirvnc.blogspot.com

Your accusation is based on supposition

As a "moderator", I can tell you we aren't omniscient. We don't know who everybody is, and that's probably a good thing. It keeps us from making subjective evaluations based on (possibly flawed) character assessments.

So we are left with the words to try to determine if somebody is being intolerably obnoxious. Like when you just implied that James was not telling the truth. And yes, that was a warning.

If you can't tolerate anonymous commentary, go elsewhere. If you decide to stay, please stop attacking commenters just because they don't sign their name.

I didn't call you an ass

I said you were behaving like one. I know from looking in the mirror exactly what it looks like. But either way, I apologize.

And for the record to everyone else, please don't behave as I do. It's easy to be upset when we've watched our democracy being sold to the highest bidder here in North Carolina. My apologies to all ... and to you Chris ... for letting my frustration get in the way of my philosophy.

You hit the nail on the head, James

No one wants to post publicly when they know what is at risk are FB & BlueNC rants, a knock at their front door or call to their employer.

Gary Pearce and the long game

From Talking About Politics.

North Carolina Democrats face a tough climb out of a deep hole. But there is hope. They lost the governor’s race simply because Governor-elect Pat McCrory faced little competition. The legislative and congressional districts were rigged against them. North Carolina proved that it’s a real presidential battleground state. Democrats on the Council of State overcame McCrory’s tide. North Carolina is becoming more urban, younger, darker and more socially tolerant – all trends that favor Democrats.

It is a time to remember Larry O’Brien’s dictum: “In politics, there are no final victories and no final defeats.”

It will be hard....

....for NC Republicans to drag our state backwards while the rest of the country continues to move forward....

But that won't stop them from trying

Overnight, NC went from being seen as a moderate state to a poster child for corporate greed, misogyny and racism. People have been contacting me from all around the country with one simple question: WTF is happening there?

My answer? We are the New Hate State. A majority of our population hates women, blacks, Hispanics, gays, environmental stewardship, public education, and poor people.

Fortunately, it truly is a last gasp from reactionary white privileged men. In 20 years, we will conclude that all of Art Pope's millions were spent on nothing of enduring importance.

McCrory doesn't have to reach

McCrory doesn't have to reach across the aisle. The Republicans have massive majorities. I have a feeling there won't be any attempt to end gerrymandering by Phil Berger after he championed it for so long when he was in the minority

True enough

I agree that he doesn't have to do anything of the sort. And I don't expect him too. He's cut from the same piece of arrogant crap as Fetzer, Tillis, Berger and Stam. Which means he'll be governor of 53% of the state instead of 100%.

I want to see the Democratic Party become

the real party of the people now. The silver lining here is that we have a chance to build something great from what has been stuck in the mud for too long. The only way we can win back the progressive heart of this state is to shine in bright comparison to the rigid right. People here have become so mistrustful of the things that make government the vehicle to a better life that they will have to be taught all over again. The things that made this state great were expansive not regressive. We have glided along on the state University's silken path for decades but these things were championed by great individuals. Where will we find our new champions now?

we are in the same place we were back in 2004

We need to take back our Party from the candidates/electeds, campaign managers, paid political operatives and the big money donors. We can do it if we try - because we tried and succeeded back in 2005!

Problem is - we have to keep control of our Party from those folks and not hand it over like we did starting in June 2008. That was our real downfall.

Chris Telesca
Wake County Verified Voting
http://noirvnc.blogspot.com
http://statewideirvnc.blogspot.com

What parallel universe have you been in?

Elected officials & candidates avoid the NCDP SEC and David Parker. If they had control, the NCDP would be functional. Instead David and his minions spread lies and conjecture about some of our best leaders.

The EOs and candidates have no control. Just like SEANC, the NCDP "patients" run the asylum.

The quit

Those who are looking forward would encourage you to crawl under a rock and remain there the next 8 years. There is work to do and we do not need to hit the ball and drag anonymous.

wafranklin

 

If the elected officials and candidates had been in control?

You do realize that there is a House and Senate Caucus of the NCDP that has offices in the NCDP headquarters?

The very folks you claim are not in control now were in control in 2010 when David Young was the hand-picked NCDP Chair - the successor to Jerry Meek. What happened there?

The results of the 2010 election tend to shoot down your theory that elected public officials, candidates, and paid political operatives know how to best run the Party and win elections.

On the other hand, Jerry Meek's grassroots 100-county strategy - working hand-in-hand with Howard Dean's 50-state strategy at the DNC - did reverse some Democratic slides in our state and across the nation.

Grassroots Dems were working to take back their Party over Meek's 4 years as NCDP Chair. And while Obama and Perdue won in 2008, the actions OFA took to dismantle the state and national strategy (unfortunately with the tacit approval of the folks at NCDP and the DNC) was a big part of the reason we lost in 2010.

Continuing the stranglehold OFA held on the Democratic Party, they continued to pile on here in NC when they picked our state for the DNC Convention. It's as if a whole bunch of people thought that holding the tailgate party in their parking lot was more important than the big game itself! That convention sucked all the oxygen out of the room, exacerbating the effects of the OFA stranglehold.

According to the NCDP, it's the SEC that makes the rules. Don't like the rules - get on the SEC and change them. If you are too lazy to do so, and prefer to stay anonymous so you can slam your political opponents from behind wherever you are, then you won't even change the NCDP.

I guess you will be part of the problem - not the solution.

Chris Telesca
Wake County Verified Voting
http://noirvnc.blogspot.com
http://statewideirvnc.blogspot.com

Hopefully the party will move forward

Hopefully the party will move forward and improve. At the same time major hurdles to the democratic process are gerrymandered redistricting, too much shady money in politics, and potentially on the horizon photo ID and other voter suppression efforts. There should be some time taken to reflect on how to improve after an election, but we also have to gear up to fight for a fair playing field by the time the next legislative session begins.

Candidates are important too

A bright spot on the national stage was the election of new progressives to the U.S. Senate. Here, when our candidates running as Democrats do not articulate Democratic values and vision or do not distinguish themselves from their Republican rivals it is difficult to motivate either Democrats or unaffiliateds who identify with us to vote for these candidates.

Election

Recriminations are understandable at a painful time like now. Yes, I feel angry with the lack luster leadership that presided over this disaster. However, I would rather not spend my energy trying to assign blame. It won't change what has happened. It won't get us out of the mess we are in.

I am concerned about what next. Clearly a change is needed. What should that change be? Who should be the next Party Chair? Let's analyze the past with an eye to learn from it rather than attacking this and that individual or group. Let's figure out what it is that we need to do and persuade our fellow Democrats that that is the right way to go. That will be easier if we are not attacking them.

One thing I have learned this political season is that I need hope. If all I see are analyses of how bad things are, I become demoralized. I need need to have hope that things can get better.

With the SEC's current membership

do not expect a different outcome.

The SEC membership is made of those with great disdain for reality. They rather sit in massive room all day on Saturday and play "Who knows more about Robert's Rules & The Plan of Organization" neither of which have ever raise one penny or got one Democrat elected.

Unfortunately, the folks who really know how to work and get folks elected have bailed to OFA....and who can blame them.....OFA actually gives folks a task...phone, canvass, etc.... use their talents whereas the NCDP structure is a "kiss my ring" and I might have you hand out slate cards.

So either we go through the whole process of rebuilding from the precinct up (which is only practical for staffing the polls on election day) which is inane....really? getting 5 democrats in a room for one night says "my precinct is organized." Then, please show up on Saturday to sit in a room and listen to resolution speeches (CEC). Then to another Saturday to sit in a room and listen to resolution speeches (District). Then to another Saturday to sit in a room and listen to resolution speeches (SEC). Really???? Doesn't anoyone else have something more productive to do?

The other option to try and educate the SEC that they need to think about elections and not what is in it for them.

A third option....teach the SEC members how to smell BS when it is abundant and in their face. David Parker made plenty of promises regarding becoming a delegate, serving on a committee, even jobs at the DNC convention (that never happened).

Either the SEC look for a reality-oriented chair OR scrap the SEC and adopt OFA's model.

OFA just might have cost us Ervin's Sup. Ct. seat

Here's how - Quite naturally OFA is 100% concerned with turning out the vote for President Obama. However, they did ZERO for any down ticket candidates. In my county callers called voters to come vote. Neighborhoods were walked in order to get people to vote. But no emphasis was placed in posting people at the polls to hand out slate cards (which we had in abundance) which included Ervin and the other judges. Voters, many inexperienced, were left to fend for themselves when it came to the judicial races. Hundreds, even thousands of votes could have been lost in my county alone. OFA played only for OFA so I do NOT think they are the model to follow.

BTW ... how many SEC meetings have you attended? How many neighborhoods have you walked? Polls watched? Voters called? How many hundreds of signs have you put out?

And I got news for you .. even out here in the sticks in 2008 we walked neighborhoods, called voters, canvassed, did all those things you attribute to OFA. We did all of that on our own. I was not as involved this year, but I can tell you that OFA is not the be all end all of political wisdom.

I actively oppose gerrymandering. Do you?

Bullshit

Handing out slate cards should be a responsibility of the NCDP precinct. In our precinct we organized full coverage from 6AM with Wake County slate cards and sample ballots. Republicans also had coverage, AND, were handing out separate "non-partisan" judicial slate cards to Democrats. This had nothing to do with OFA. Don't blame OFA for being more organized and user-friendly than NCDP. Several of our poll workers were doing double duty. OFA baited the hooks, it was up to NCDP to reel them in.

Gee. I didn't know you were spending so much time

up here in Person County!! Like you you know anythning about how things worked up here. We have a very finite number of people, good people, who volunteered their time and energy. They were led by the OFA guy who did OFA stuff. They were not experienced; they did not know what to do, nor how to do it.

You better back your little know-it-all ass up on this one.

I actively oppose gerrymandering. Do you?

Talk about "un-democratic" and "un-Democratic"!

do not expect a different outcome.

The SEC membership is made of those with great disdain for reality. They rather sit in massive room all day on Saturday and play "Who knows more about Robert's Rules & The Plan of Organization" neither of which have ever raise one penny or got one Democrat elected.

That is not true. The large majority of SEC members are elected at their County Party Conventions. They have to run for a seat on the SEC based on what they have done for the Party at the local level: organize precincts, Get Out The Vote, work with their County BOE, etc. Some get into the SEC by being officers of auxiliary organizations at the county and state level. Some get their by virtue of being elected public officials.

I got my seat on the Wake SEC after being a proxy for a few meetings. I ran against the "establishment" backed candidate, and I ran on my record of organizing my precinct, turning out the vote, working to get the Public Confidence in Elections Act passed in 2005.

I also worked to keep Wake County using 100% op-scan paper ballots (where I worked with a coalition of other Verified Voting activists) to overcome a 2-1 vote (one Dem and one GOP member vs one Dem) on the Wake BOE who voted to use DRE touchscreen machines for Early Voting. We overcame the BOE vote by working the Wake County Commissioners to vote 7-0 to reject the initial Wake BOE hybrid plan and then vote 7-0 to stay 100% paper. That's how I beat the Establishment candidate by 3-2.

Then we helped elect a more grassroots county Party Chair named Doris Weaver who beat an incumbent Chair by 3-2 again. We turned around and organized more of our precincts and had 100% coverage at our precincts in May 2008 (with no help from OFA mind you). We did have help from OFA for the November 2008 election, but damned little help for down-ballot races.

And as for Robert's Rules of Order and the NCDP Plan of Organization - I guess you don't feel that a deliberative body that needs to elect officers and conduct business needs rules to operate by? So you support utter chaos or extreme authoritarian top-down rule? Not very "democratic" or Democratic, wouldn't you say?

Unfortunately, the folks who really know how to work and get folks elected have bailed to OFA....

Most of the people who gravitated to OFA had no experience working on elections or in the Party before 2008. So there was no fore-knowledge or experience in those folks. And if you look at the results for elections OTHER than Obama, your OFA methods don't really work all that well. They sure as hell didn't work well in 2009 outside Charlotte, or in 2010 across the state and nation - did they?

and who can blame them.....

I can blame them. Most folks who have been around since before 2008 can blame them. Someone has to be blamed for 2010 - and it ain't just Art Pope.

Most of the folks I saw working as OFA volunteers in 2008 were either people who had no experience in elections or in the Party before 2008, or they were folks who were Party volunteers who were "poached" by OFA. The NCDP and many county parties had a whole summer 2008 planned with GOTV activities that would also build the Party at the same time. Unfortunately, we were pulled off doing those things by the NCDP who told us OFA was figuring things out to make them better. The plan was to idle those Party volunteers (whose names we had to give OFA) who would then be aggressively "poached" by OFA into working for OFA. So you had a bunch of volunteers (including elected precinct Chairs) who were taken off of getting volunteers in their precincts to canvass in their own precincts and poll greet in their own precincts to stop doing that - and do whatever the OFA staffers told them to do. OFA staffers were bad-mouthing the party.

Former Wake Dems Chair Doris Weaver will tell you (as she told me) that a well-known OFA staffer called her up and asked her to stop wasting her time working for the County Party and come work for OFA. She couldn't believe that this kid would call up a sitting county Party Chair in Wake County and tell her that. But that's what he did - and it went on all over the state.

What about Bev Perdue who just had to have David Young as NCDP Chair in 2009? Why did she need him? And why did Young hire an ED tied to the Blue Dogs to be the new ED, then hire a bunch of folks mostly from OFA to staff the Party, where they did little to no party building and then lost the 2010 elections?

OFA actually gives folks a task...phone, canvass, etc....

Is that because OFA doesn't trust them to use their own talents to figure out what needs to be done in their own precincts - that might help not only elect Obama but also other down-ballot candidates AND build the party from the precinct on up?

NC had 112 years of largely Democratic majority governance before OFA showed up. There was a gain of only ONE SINGLE DEMOCRATIC SENATE SEAT in 2008 (so much for Obama's coat-tails) and then we lost big time in NC (and elsewhere in the nation) in 2010. So while OFA may give a group of largely inexperienced people a series of tasks to do to keep them busy and make them feel good, the proof is in the pudding - or the outcome of the races. OFA methods don't work all that well in the end, or much in the middle for that matter.

use their talents whereas the NCDP structure is a "kiss my ring" and I might have you hand out slate cards.

No one in NCDP or all but one county Party asks anyone to "kiss their ring" to hand out slate cards or anything else. However, one county Party Chair affiliated with the group that wanted to oust Parker was not only refusing to appoint acting Precinct Chairs unless they gave their allegiance to the Chair (which is not allowed under the NCDP Plan of Organization) - but they were also selling positions on the county Party slate card (to the point of initially refusing to support candidates who did not "buy in"). So in reality the only folks wanting others to "kiss their ring" were in the anti-Parker camp.

So either we go through the whole process of rebuilding from the precinct up (which is only practical for staffing the polls on election day) which is inane....really? getting 5 democrats in a room for one night says "my precinct is organized." Then, please show up on Saturday to sit in a room and listen to resolution speeches (CEC). Then to another Saturday to sit in a room and listen to resolution speeches (District). Then to another Saturday to sit in a room and listen to resolution speeches (SEC). Really???? Doesn't anoyone else have something more productive to do?

You seem to forget that there are more things for Democrats to do than just get 5 people to show up for a precinct meeting, then make quorum at other meetings after that.

You organize your precinct so you can elect officers and delegates to represent your precinct at other meetings to ultimately decide the Democratic Party platform and the officers who will lead the Party. Or do you think that one person (a Governor or President) deciding their legislative agenda based on what's good for their biggest donors is more "democratic"?

You spend the time between February and November (or October in some places) rebuilding the team of people you need at the precinct, county, district and state level. In Wake County in the 2007-2009, we had a great team (mostly former Deaniacs) who came in and set up a sign-shop and GOTV operation for 2008 that was the earliest and best planned in the state (according to NCDP staffers at the time). All volunteer - and none of it top-down from OFA.

I am elected at my precinct and county party level to represent the interests of the folks who elected me. I am responsible to them - not to the people that I elect.

You seem really hostile to the whole notion of representative government made up of elected officials who are elected to be public servants. Or do you think that we should be serving them and kissing their rings and asses?

The other option to try and educate the SEC that they need to think about elections and not what is in it for them.

I think about elections all the time - and I think about all the losses in my county, state and around the country in places that followed the OFA methods. I think about how un-democratic it is to allow any paid professional campaign staff to try and dictate to elected party officers how they will do their jobs.

I also think how sad it is for people who want to be lead by paid political operatives and who will give up their power and leverage for so little. For example, I and about 60% of other Americans wanted Single-Payer health care, not a mandate to by health insurance from a private business.

You are free to educate SEC members. They are all known in their counties. However, very few of us will take seriously any comments coming from someone who wishes to remain anonymous. If you are interested in a serious discussion over the role of our Party vs any one specific campaign or small groups of campaigns (which are in reality private businesses), then I'd be happy to discuss that with you. And if you don't like what you hear from me, then you are free to vote for other SEC members from your county. But you won't be able to vote for me or against me if you aren't either a precinct Chair or Vice Chair or a delegate from your precinct. That's how rules work!

A third option....teach the SEC members how to smell BS when it is abundant and in their face. David Parker made plenty of promises regarding becoming a delegate, serving on a committee, even jobs at the DNC convention (that never happened).

Not everyone who ran for a delegate slot could win election as a delegate. David made no such promises about that. What promises for committee positions and jobs at the DNC do you claim Parker promised people that you claim either never happened or that he didn't deliver on?

Either the SEC look for a reality-oriented chair OR scrap the SEC and adopt OFA's model.

Why would anyone in their right mind adopt a top-down rule of a state Party by a private business where they don't have a say in what goes on or how they do what they do? That's not very "democratic"!

And the only way for the SEC to be scrapped would be for the SEC members to vote to scrap "democracy" and go with corporate rule. I don't see that happening. And if you claim to be so experienced or practical, why would you even propose such a thing?

Why don't you propose just scrapping ALL of our elected public government, and letting the corporations run things? Sounds like that's exactly what you are advocating.

Chris Telesca
Wake County Verified Voting
http://noirvnc.blogspot.com
http://statewideirvnc.blogspot.com

Hope

Here's hope and here's some more hope.

Republican shenanigans in NC will be trumped by the the US Supreme Court. In the meantime, lower courts will continue to be the path of first resort to stymie the influence of the Tillisberger. This is why the Southern Environmental Law Center and the ACLU are the two non-profits to which I will make major gifts each year.

I am sure you mean

I am sure you mean Mississippi.

I wish I meant Oregon

I've always thought NC could be the eastern Oregon. A good libertarian subculture with a healthy dose of social responsibility. Not to mention a beautiful coast and great mountains.

We could even vote by mail!

Richard Moore for NCDP Chair

Who better?

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